Page 2 of 6

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 2:19 pm
by wheels
I'm guessing that the soy protein stops separation of the fat during cooking/smoking?
Is there an alternative to using soy protein? Milk Powder? Rusk?
Or can someone point me in the right direction to obtain some?

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 3:04 pm
by Oddley
I'm not sure that milk powder or rusk, would give the same texture. The ingredient amounts, would also have to be experimented with, as Soya Protein will bind water at about 5 to 1, it also enhances the binding of fat .

Soya Protein Can be bought

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 3:17 pm
by wheels
Many thanks Oddley

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 4:18 pm
by Big Guy
I'll have to try your recipe, It's close to my smoked sausage recipe.

Smoked Sausage

15 lbs. Pork butts
4 Tbs. Salt
3 tsp. prauge powder #2
2 Tbs. Black pepper
1- 1/2 Tbs. Ground caraway
1- 1/2 Tbs. Ground coriander
1- 1/2 Tbs. Garlic powder
1- 1/2 Tbs. Mace
1- 1/2 quarts ice water
1 cup Soya Protein concentrate
1 cup skim milk powder

Grind all meat through a coarse plate. Add ice water then spices mix.
Stuff into natural hog casings. Let sit overnight to blend spices and set the links. Smoke for about 6 hrs at 150-180 degrees until the internal temp reaches 152 F Quench in ice water and let hang at room temp for an hour to desired colour is reached. Vacuum pack and freeze.

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 5:01 pm
by wheels
Sorry I may seem a bit thick - but I want to get these right.
You say:
When the temperature of the bottom of the sausage reaches at least 67 C about 3-4 hours take out and immerse in ice cold water until the temperature reads 43 C Allow to bloom till desired colour is reached. Place in Fridge overnight. Then cook or vac Pac.

So you cook them to 67 C and then you cook them again prior to use?

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 5:13 pm
by Oddley
Hi Wheels the safe temp to cook pork too is 72 C. I've found that if you initially cook to, too high a temp too quickly, the texture changes to slightly grainy.

If you follow wittdog's instructions and slowly bring it up to 152 F 66.66 C the texture is solid and smooth. So you can take a chance and eat them out of the oven or after being cooled. Not tried it so can't tell you what the texture is like. I prefer to cool them and then grill them.

PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 5:21 pm
by wheels
Thanks again Oddley :D

PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 1:46 am
by wittdog
wheels you can either use the soy or powdered milk in the same measurement. you are correct that it is used to stop the seperation of the fat during the smoking process. The soy/PM makes the sausage set up kind off and can make it a little more diffucult to stuff depending on the stuffer..It's rough with a horn stuffer but a breeze with the bucket stuffer.

Oddley if the temp gets up to 152*F you are correct they are safe to eat like that "uncooked"....The texture is that of a pepparoni a little of the greesey side but very good sliced on crackers with some horseradish..You really do need to do that with a link sometime.

Big Guy I look forword to hearing your thougths on this recipe.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 10:08 am
by Oddley
Hi guys,

It looks like I opened my big mouth and then proceeded to put my foot in it... :lol:

The internal temps have always confused me a bit so I should have held my tongue until I had researched a bit more. Even after researching a bit there is still some conflicting info out there. For instance:

Southwark council's website says.

Bacteria multiply most rapidly between 10 C - 55 C or 50 F - 131 F

Southwark council recommends you bring the core temp to at least 65 C - 149 F for 10 minutes 70 C - 158 F for 2 minutes.

So extrapolating from this I think if you held the core temp at 66.66 C - 152 F for 7 minutes it would be safe to eat. ... dMeat.html

Whereas the International Food Safety Council says.

Minimum Internal Cooking Temperatures Chart

140F (60C) for all foods that will be held hot prior to service. 145F (63C) for 15 seconds for fish; seafood; veal; lamb; mutton; pork; pork roasts and cured pork (e.g. ham); raw shell eggs for immediate service; and any fish and meat not specifically mentioned below.

155F (68C) for 15 seconds for ground beef, ratites (e.g. ostrich, emu); injected meats; ground fish or ground meat (e.g. pork, beef); raw eggs not prepared for immediate service; and inspected game animals.

165F (74C) for 15 seconds for poultry; wild game; stuffed fish; stuffed meat; stuffed pasta; stuffed poultry; stuffed ratites (ostrich or emu); stuffing containing fish, meat, poultry or ratites. Also, any dishes containing previously cooked foods.

165F (74C) for all raw animal foods cooked in a microwave. The food should be rotated or stirred at least midway through cooking process, covered to retain moisture, and allowed to stand covered for two minutes following cooking to allow for post cooking heat to rise.

Whole beef roasts, pork roasts and ham are safely cooked after reaching the minimum internal temperature for the prescribed amount of time as follows:

130F (54C) for 121 minutes
132F (56C) for 77 minutes
134F (57C) for 47 minutes
136F (58C) for 23 minutes
138F (59C) for 19 minutes
140F (60C) for 12 minutes
142F (61C) for 8 minutes
144F (62C) for 5 minutes
145F (63C) for 3 minutes

Confused? I still am a bit. So it's not only about internal temps but holding them for a certain amount of time.

I think what I said earlier would be ok. hold the core temp at 66.66C - 152F for 7 minutes and it will be safe to eat out of the oven.

PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 11:59 am
by wheels
Thank everyone - I'm looking forward to trying these.

Grandpa Jumbos Polish Sausage

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 9:38 am
by TonyE
Soya Protein from Scobies, comes in quantities of 2 1/2Kgs which is far more than I could ever use. Has anybody bought this quantity, if so, do you have 500mgs I could buy from you,

I have tried a couple of recipes that had it as an ingredient, I tried substituting, the end result was too dry.

I would really like to get hold of a seasonable quantity.


PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:13 pm
by wallie
I agree Oddley these are great sausages.
I made them yesterday from your version of Wittdog's recipe and I have just had one today with homemade peaspudding and it took me back 50years, brought back memories of staggering home on a Saturday night and calling in the local pork shop to get what was known as a: "Saveloy and Biscuit"
You are right it is reminiscent of the Saveloy.
They were nice and juicy and the texture was spot on.
I used Empro and Liquid smoke from Scobies in place of the soy and smoke powder
I also use Pokelsaz for the curing salt, this is great stuff for bacon etc and it was recommended to me by a local butcher.Also I am able to buy it locally, its from a firm named Dalziel who have branches all over the UK.
But I think the next time I make this I will leave it in the fridg for 24 hours before using the oven process. I think this will give the cure time to develop the nice pink colour to the sausage. My thinking is that this would not happen if you bring it up to 67c straight after stuffing.
Anyhow thanks to Wittdog and Oddley for this great recipe.
This is the number 1 sausage site on the net, keep up the good work.

PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:17 pm
by wittdog
If its a color issue and not flavor from the cure...then add 1 TBL of Paprika to the seasoning blend per 10 lbs....You will get a real nice color and it doesn't effect the color.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 2:29 pm
by lemonD
Is this the recipe for the sausage making videos you have on youtube?


PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:18 pm
by wittdog
Yes it is. I've cut back on the Soy to 1 Cup per 10lbs of meat.