First time ham cure/cook questions

[dougal]

I do really appologise to Dougal if I annoyed him at all.

No need! Honestly.
I'd like to apologise to anyone that might be offended by my occasional seeming brusqueness.
I'm a slow typist, and, too often want to say a lot. Part of my long-windness is a usually futile attempt to avoid misunderstanding of the precise point I'm trying to make. And in that attempt, social skills may be overlooked And I don't half get annoyed with *myself* if my attempts to avoid being misunderstood have failed.

If I am in error, I want to be the first to know. Always.



The hairy thing from Star Wars was IIRC called a Wookie. Specifically to get in the line "Go easy on him, he's only a Wookie" or somesuch {'Rookie' being north american for novice or beginner.}

[tristar]

Sorry Dougal, Don't quite understand your point!

[dougal]

Sorry Dougal, Don't quite understand your point!

... that and a tendancy to take things both too seriously, and at face value!

[Paul Kribs]

I got to carve my ham last night and it carved well, and was succulent and tastey.. very pleased with it.. best yet.



Regards, Paul Kribs

[Vernon Smith]

Well, its a full year since my last disaster with a ham and I have plucked up the courage to have another go. I hope there are still some members following this thread. If anyone has any information on dry curing a small ham I would be pleased to hear it. Wet curing was a pain so I reckon I will try pumping with brine to add 10% of the ham weight (excluding bone) and dry curing the outside. This composite method might be unconventional but I don't see why it won't work. I have browsed the forum but can't find any dry cure techniques for simple cooked ham. Anybody with experience out there? Please help. I reckon that I should have the process completed within 5 days if I pump. Comments please! BTW I am out of stock of saltpetre so I will have to use just sugar and salt. To cook, I will suspend this one in steam instead of total immersion. I think my last attempt was overcooked and far too salt. Steaming until the internal temperature reaches 76 deg C might give better results.
All the best,
Vernon

[saucisson]

We've lost several members since you last posted in this thread , alas.

I see no reason not to dry cure ham, just treat it like bacon/parma ham and use the standard 20g salt, 10g sugar, 0.5g saltpetre per kilo mix. I'll send you some saltpetre if you need some, but I have no idea how long post to the Solomon Isles takes.

Dave

[Vernon Smith]

Dave,
I heard about Rik Trense but have any other Forum pals shuffled off this mortal coil? I hope not. Thanks for your offer of some KNO3, I would very much like some but I am not sure how you could send it. A small packet by airmail to the Solomon Islands costs �1.58 for 100g and �2.69 for 200g but you can't post it if you declare it as "dangerous goods". If
you are willing to try sending say 150g and truthfully calling it "preserving salt" I don't think any harm will be done. I leave it up to you. It takes 2 - 3 weeks from the UK to the Solomons but don't worry about the time factor. Do you have my postal address? I will send the cash to cover your expenses.

Meanwhile, I will try a 1/2 leg of 2.5 kg incl bone, pumped with 10% (say 150g) brine whilst the outside I will dry cure with 20g cure / kg meat but without KNO3. I am hoping that 4 days should be enough. My first disaster worked out to 7.1% salt up take according to Oddley so I hope this joint will take up far less. BTW Oddley if you pick up this thread please be so kind as to email me your brine calculator. The one I downloaded last year has become corrupted and the download site doesn't list your calculator any longer. I hope this ham turns out better than the last so I would welcome any input regarding my proposed composite curing method. Soaking for 3 weeks in a brine bucket is too much trouble.
All the best,
Vernon

[wheels]

I understand that "curing" without Nitrate/Nitrite can lead to a severe risk of botulism. Even organic producers will use one or the other to ensure safe meet (see www.graigfarm.co.uk/curing_meat.htm)

Given the temperatures you mention that the meat is to be cured at - you may wish to take advice as to whether the process will be safe.

On another subject, why combine injection and dry curing. Given the weight of meat why not bone and roll it, then injection cure with one of (say) Oddley's recipes? 2.5 kg boned & rolled in a small container would probably only need a brine made with 1.5-2 litres of water to cover.

Hope this helps.

Phil

[Vernon Smith]

Phil,
Have you seen the thread about "bacteria in curing" that I started about a year ago? Lots of good stuff from Oddley, Saucisson and others. Clostridium Botulinum requires anearobic conditions and my curing definitely won't be anaerobic. My reasoning for the pumping is to get the salt into the muscle and immediately put a stop to any adverse bacteria. Say 4 or 5 days at 5 deg C should prevent any bacteria reproducing anyway. The salt itself is the curing agent in my case. I concede that that large scale commercial curing operations could easily create anaerobic conditions so KNO3 is definitely required to eliminate even the slightest possibility of Botulism. I dry cure a lot of bacon without KNO3 and I am still alive (I think). Anyway, I am experimenting with this small joint to see how it turns out. The wrapped joint takes up less space in the fridge and cold strorage space is at a premium here in the tropics.
Nice to hear from you,
Vernon

[wheels]

Vernon
You obviously have the knowledge and experience to do this. You can only work within the constraints of location and availability of ingredients etc. I look forward to you reporting back with the results.

I will be interested to see whether a ham product results or whether it turns out as "pickled pork".

Re the cooking of the ham - I find that by putting the meat in a stock pot, covered with plenty of water, aromatics etc., heating to boiling on the top of the stove and then putting it in the oven at 80 - 100C and cooking to an internal temp of 75-80C; I achieve a ham, rather than a boiled bacon, taste.

Good luck
Phil

[Vernon Smith]

Phil,
Tks for the input. The oven idea sounds just what I need. I have a fan assisted electric oven that might not be accurate at such low temperatures so I will try it first with something else before I risk the ham.
Now here's something that I never been able to work out. What makes bacon bacon? What makes pickled pork pickled pork ? And what makes ham ham? As far as I have been able to work out, it's the curing time and cooking temperature/time but I am not sure. My bacon always turns out splendidly after one week dry curing and a light/medium smoking but my first ham was a disaster. I think oversmoking and overcooking turned the joint into dreadfully salty bacon instead of ham. I have never made pickled pork belly but I think it spends a long time in brine and I don 't think it is ever smoked. If anyone can clearly define the diffrerence between the three processes I would be pleased to learn them.
All the best,
Vernon

[Vernon Smith]

For the full story of the ham below, I started a new thread called
Cordon Bleu Ham from the Solomon Islands because it is no longer a First Time Cure-Cook topic.



All the best
Vernon