Standard Ingredients For Pork Sausage

[Parson Snows]

Bob

I wrote

Basically all of the shoulder isn't meat and all of the fat isn't fat. For a lean pork shoulder a figure of 8.8 % fat is used and for hard pork back fat a figure of 78.6 % fat is used. Therefore your fat content is (1.5 x 8.8/100) + (0.5 x 78.6/100) = 0.525 lbs of fat. So 0.525/2.0 x 100 =26.25 % total fat content.

You wrote

When Parsons Snow did the calculation using my pork mix figures he came up with around 25%. I am using a different estimate for VL trim, and it comes out to 40%. If I used 25% based on my method my sausage would come out like sawdust. So I believe we are using the same pork mix you call 25%.

You wrote

I use a pork shoulder with outside fat trimmed so I can get the weight of "lean" pork, which I take to be 20% fat. Then I use 1.5 lb lean to 0.5 lb fat, giving a 40% fat.

This is not �lean� pork but 80/20 (also referred to as 80 % VL, 80:20 visual lean) ie 80 % lean meat and 20 % fat.

The recommended/typical fat content for 80 % VL Pork Shoulder/Boston Butt is 28.0 %
The recommended/typical fat content for hard pork fat back is 78.6 %

Therefore using the above figures your fat content is (1.5 x 28.0/100) + (0.5 x 78.6/100) = 0.420 + 0.393 = 0.813 lbs of fat.
So 0.813/2.0 x 100 = 40.65 % total fat content.


I hope that this clears everything up.

Kind regards

Parson Snows

[Bob]

Bob I'm not sure but I think Franco may be considering making that recipe up into a sausage mix the more rusk the bigger profit. don't get me wrong nothing against profit at all good luck to him.

My purpose in posting the comment was to get a clarification. I am still in the process of deciding how much breadcrumbs to include in my Standard Ingredients list for English sausage for 1 lb pork. I have been using 2 T. + 4 T. water, but in my next batch I will try 1 T. + 1 T. water.

I have made some commercial recipes posted here and the ones I've tried I have had to substantially adjust to give acceptable results.

This is all grist to the mill for me because I get loads of ideas from these recipes. So I would not bank on all the recipes here. But some I would highly recommend.

Thanks for the heads up. I will be on the watch for recipes that are commercial versions.

What I hope to do is be able to make my own variations on English sausage, which is what I do with other sausages.

[Parson Snows]

Oddley wrote

I would not bank on all the recipes here. But some I would highly recommend.

I could see where this was going from the beginning that�s why I suggested that

it might be a nice feature to be able to have people "rate" a recipe plus post a comment

It's only going to get worse the longer it's left, trust me.
How do you let other forum members know what�s good and what�s not? Lose credibilty and you'll most likely NEVER get it back.

Bob wrote

Thanks for the heads up. I will be on the watch for recipes that are commercial versions.

Bob also wrote

On another matter, I made the Garlic Pork Bangers recipe (with 1 lb. pork) with breadcrumbs (2.5 T. breadcrumbs + 5 T. water) and it is delicious. I added 1/2 t. red pepper flakes, otherwise I followed the recipe. My wife is not a sausage person, but she said it was exceptionally tasty.

I wrote

Bob
I'm glad that you like the Garlic and Pork Sausages, it's one of my favourites also. I'll pass on your comments to their creator UK butcher Charles Harris of Cornwall.

This is a commercial recipe. Most professionals wouldn't share/give anything away yet Charles Harris of Tywardreath Butchers was kind enough to as was Phil Groth of Phil's Sausages, and Paul Matthew and Chris Fenwick from Matthews Meats in Lincolnshire (I emailed Franco their Lincolshire sausage recipe, which they kindly gave me)

Hope that this is of some use to you

Kind regards

Parson Snows

[Oddley]

Parson my intension was not to offend anybody. I have yet to try the garlic sausage and you have not posted or sent to me the Lincolnshire recipe ( I feel very hurt... )

I was talking about recipes from books. As I said it didn't matter to me because from every disaster I learn important lessons.

Like buy a dog.

[Parson Snows]

taken from the "shop" portion of this website

Rusk is an essential ingredient in sausage making, used by all professional sausage makers and experienced home users alike. Use up to 10% rusk in your sausage to improve the texture and bite, it helps bind the fat within the sausage and helps retain moisture making a more succulent sausage.

Franco wrote

I believe rusk used as 10% of a sausage is a little too much and now use around 5% plus 5% water, I add the rusk dry to the sausage ad add the water as ice.

I typically use 10 % though as I mentioned before other use none. It's all a case of personal preference.

kind regards

Parson Snows

[Bob]

I typically use 10 % though as I mentioned before other use none. It's all a case of personal preference.

I must admit I am beginning to get very confused. Maybe that's a sign I am about to decide what I want.

How do you measure breadcrumbs if you want, for example, 10% equivalent rusk?

[Oddley]

To change the subject I'm yet again trying to make Saveloys tomorrow.

I have thrown away more meat trying to make these things than Bob has thrown down his Beagles throat.

[Fatman]

Hi Bob

I would say this:- pork/fat 50/50, salt, black pepper (heavy on the pepper) and sage.

Regards

Fatman

[Bob]

Earlier I said:

I am forever going to use 3/4 lb vl-trimmed pork butt plus 1/4 lb pure fat and be done with it.

I must amend that statement, which meant to apply "with all things equal". That fat percentage is for sausage without breadcrumbs. I am hoping to reduce the fat to 30% by adding breadcrumbs.

I tried 1 T. breadcrumbs + 1 T. water in the last one and it was not as "moist" as earlier. So I am now going to put 2T. breadcrumbs + 2 T. water on my Standard Ingredients list for English-style sausages.

I wonder if you could add Texas as a region in your collection. Texas regional English sausage would always include 1 t. sage and 1/2 t. red pepper flakes, in addition to 1 t. salt and 1/2 t. coarse ground black pepper - and of course 2 T. breadcrumbs + 2 T. water.

From that Standard Ingredient list one can add the various other spices for each of the regional sausages you all have mentioned. Speaking of which I would still like to complete the list, so if Parsons Snow, or anyone else, would please either post or email me the complete list, I would be appreciative.

Cumberland Sausage
Lincolnshire Sausage
Manchester Sausage
Epping Sausage
Cambridge Sausage
Oxford Sausage
Yorkshire Sausage

[Parson Snows]

Oddley

You wrote

Parson my intension was not to offend anybody

The posting was partly to keep Franco and �munki-boy� aware of the direction that the forum has started heading and what�s in store for the future if no action is taken � postings questioning postings; outweighing new information being posted. As to me being offended, trust me I�m not offended that easily (born and bred in pubs and grew up in Whitechapel). I explained to those involved what I was intending to do with their recipes and permission was kindly given to me in good faith and with their blessings. However, some twenty years ago I knew of one butcher (now deceased) who had two sons. Neither of them was interested in going into the butchery trade so I offered to buy his recipes from him, and at a reasonable price, as approximately 70 % to 75 % of them were VERY good. Him comment to me was �I�ll take these to my f*****g grave�. So there must be some really good hams, sausages and bacon whichever way he ended up going.

You wrote

I have yet to try the garlic sausage

The recipe�s out there waiting for you. Let me know what you think when you do try them. I do however; think that it�s essential that you use a garlic press to make the pieces of garlic small enough � unless you�re really deft with a knife. I don�t think that I mentioned that on the recipe (have to check!). I normally copy these recipes out verbatim as I would like people to first try them the way that they were given to me � though I may add a note, or two if something�s unclear or a major hurdle etc. You can�t buy experience.

You wrote

� you have not posted or sent to me the Lincolnshire recipe (I feel very hurt... )

If Franco has no use for it then I�ll be more than happy to post it on the forum. The decision lies with Franco as he PM�d me for it specifically, I believe to consider including as one of his sausage seasonings/mixes. I apologise for this, but I do appreciate that Franco�s also trying to run a business as well as provide a FREE and hopefully �excellent/accurate� sausage making forum.

You wrote

As I said it didn't matter to me because from every disaster I learn important lessons. Like buy a dog.

I hope that none of the forum members are with the RSPCA (or equivalent abroad) or in fact dogs!

Kind regards

Parson Snows

[Bob]

The posting was partly to keep Franco and �munki-boy�

Who is "munki-boy"?

However, some twenty years ago I knew of one butcher (now deceased) who had two sons. Neither of them was interested in going into the butchery trade so I offered to buy his recipes from him, and at a reasonable price, as approximately 70 % to 75 % of them were VERY good. Him comment to me was �I�ll take these to my f*****g grave�. So there must be some really good hams, sausages and bacon whichever way he ended up going.

There is always the possibility that these recipes were standard.

Someone took a sample of Col. Sanders Kentucky Fried Chicken - the one with 11 herbs and spices - to a chemist for analysis. It turned out that the Col.'s "secret recipe" consisted of flour, salt and pepper and nothing else.

I remind everyone that food must not be toxic to people, so food makers have to make it as bland as they can to keep from causing liability. I am not saying that spices used in sausage are a problem, but if there is any hint of an allergy or toxic reaction possible, the maker has to issue warnings so people don't eat the wrong things. That tends to cast a negative image, so makers keep their ingredients as standard as possible.

Another example of lies in advertising was Lee Iococa's invention several decades ago. When he took over bankrupt Chrysler (later bailed out by the govt), he got Ricardo Montelban (Fantasy Island) to do a commercial for the top-line Chrysler motorcar.

Ricardo carried on about the "rich Corinthian leather". Only thing, Corinth does not have a leather industry, never had one either. Iococa made it up because it sounded good, expecially with Montelban's thick sensual accent: "Reeech Corintheeeean Leeeeather".

I am sure your friend was legitimate, but you never know for sure.

The recipe�s out there waiting for you.

I wish it were that easy. You mentioned several recipes in past posts but I cannot find them. The Search facility on this bulletin board really sucks.

For example, with modern Search facilities, you can create a keyphrase by enclosing the keywords in quotes. Thus, I should be able to find "Cambridge Sausage" easily. But no luck - unless I am missing something.

[Bob]

Hi Bob

I would say this:- pork/fat 50/50, salt, black pepper (heavy on the pepper) and sage.

Regards

Fatman

I tried 50/50 and it was a bit too fat. So I backed it down to 60/40 and got the right mix. I backed it down to 70/30 and it was too dry.

However, when I make up a new batch of pork mix I am going to try 70/30 with breadcrumbs. I really would like to work at 70/30 not only for the reduced fat but mainly because that's what our pork butt (shoulder) runs. IOW, at 70/30 I do not have to trim the pork butt VL to get the lean amount nor do I have to add any extra fat.

It is not easy to come by pork back fat at this time of the year. Texas has 20 million people and at least 5 million of them hunt deer in November and December. That's a lot of back fat for venison sausage, so the deer processors buy it all up from the packers. In fact, the last round of pork butts on sale were stripped of all visual fat, which usually never happens.

On another note, I tried 1 T. breadcrumbs + 1 T. water (per lb. pork) in the last sasuage recipe. Everything else was the same. The sausage is not as moist as when I used 2 T. breadcrumbs + 2 T. water, so I am going back to the original 2 T.

[Parson Snows]

Bob

You wrote

Who is "munki-boy"?

Franco�s �Web Guy�

You wrote

There is always the possibility that these recipes were standard.

The pork, fat, salt, pepper aside .. trust me they weren�t. Even though the sausage seasoning (herbs and spices) typically accounts for ONLY 2.0 % to 3.0 % of the total sausage weight it�s the most important 2.0 % to 3.0 %. It�s this mixture that make one butcher�s sausages better than anothers.

You wrote

You mentioned several recipes in past posts but I cannot find them. The Search facility on this bulletin board really sucks.

Pork and Garlic Sausage Recipe
http://forum.sausagemaking.org/viewtopic.php?t=347

kind regards

Parson Snows

[Bob]

I use a pork shoulder with outside fat trimmed so I can get the weight of "lean" pork, which I take to be 20% fat. Then I use 1.5 lb lean to 0.5 lb fat, giving a 40% fat.

This is not �lean� pork

I now know what is causing this discrepency. It's over the use of the term "lean".

What I meant to say above is:

"I use a pork shoulder with outside fat trimmed so I can get the weight of the lean meat, which I take as 80%."

IOW, by trimming off VL fat I end up with 80% lean meat, and therefore I know how much fat to add.

but 80/20 [/b](also referred to as 80 % VL, 80:20 visual lean) ie 80 % lean meat and 20 % fat.

That's exactly what I meant to say.

The recommended/typical fat content for 80 % VL Pork Shoulder/Boston Butt is 28.0 %.

I do not understand that. If 80% VL pork shoulder has 20% fat, how can it have 28% fat?
Untrimmed pork shoulder typically has 30% fat, so that may be what you mean.

The recommended/typical fat content for hard pork fat back is 78.6 %.

Actually it varies all over the place depending on the butcher. That's why I trim out all the lean which add to the lean meat weight. However, of late it has been 100% fat so I have not had to trim it.

Therefore using the above figures your fat content is (1.5 x 28.0/100) + (0.5 x 78.6/100) = 0.420 + 0.393 = 0.813 lbs of fat.
So 0.813/2.0 x 100 = 40.65 % total fat content.

You arrived at the 40% figure in a different way than I did, but we are nevertheless in complete agreement.

As mentioned earlier, I am hoping that by adding breadcrumbs I will be able to use pork shoulder without any added fat which would result in 30%.

[Bob]

Bob
I'm glad that you like the Garlic and Pork Sausages, it's one of my favourites also. I'll pass on your comments to their creator UK butcher Charles Harris of Cornwall.

This is a commercial recipe. Most professionals wouldn't share/give anything away yet Charles Harris of Tywardreath Butchers was kind enough to as was Phil Groth of Phil's Sausages, and Paul Matthew and Chris Fenwick from Matthews Meats in Lincolnshire (I emailed Franco their Lincolshire sausage recipe, which they kindly gave me)

I consider that an "artisan recipe". Over here the term "commercial" takes on the connotation of a huge corporate operation. like Con Agra. When I said I would be on the lookout for "commercial recipes" I was referring to the ones you find with large corporations.