FDA Processors calcs.Is method one viable for home curers.

[captain wassname]

Internet connectinn here is off and on Its been a bit wet
.So I havent taken my ball and gone home.
Will post again when I get a chance

Jim.

[wheels]

Jim

You've had it pretty bad in your 'neck of the woods', I hope that you're not affected?

Phil

[wheels]

NCPaul

I assume that you are going to test until no further changes take place (equilibrium)?

If so, I hold on to queries about which figures relate to what until the full data is available.

In the meantime, what info do forum members want from the figures?

Phil

[NCPaul]

Wheels
I plan to continue until Wednesday (12 days total) then into the bin to make room for Thanksgiving. I'll try to update the spreedsheet then and send it to you. We can work together to extract the useful info from the pile of number crunching I did (most of which is more confusing than useful). Thanks for your help!

[captain wassname]

Phil thanks for your concern we are midway between Cockermouth and Workington. So having a bit of trouble with our phone and a bit of damp in the garage is no problem.
I hope that Cockermouth will recover we had 3 proper butchers 2 greengrocers and 2 ironmongers as well as an independent chemists,a wool shopand 2 toyshops a music shop a computer shop and loads of pubs and resteraunts. .There are almost no chainsSainsburys,Boots Greggs and Wilkies. I do worry how these small buisnesses will cope.

Jim

[wheels]

Blimey, you're right in the thick of it. Here's hoping that the Gov't promises actually materialise. Mum's family are from Bowness so she still has a lot of friends in the area.

Phil

[wheels]

OK to get back on topic.

NCPaul has asked me to collate and post his test results for a piece of meat calculated to Method 2 of the FDA Meat Inspectors' Handbook.

The Tests

He says, "I tested the brine every day for % NaCl and tested the brine on day 4 and 11 for % Water. I tested the meat for % NaCl at the beginning and calculated 1200 g of meat to have 2.04 g NaCl natural salt; this agreed with the nutritional analysis on the packaging. I tested the meat at the end (inside/outside) for % NaCl. I did weigh the meat at day 4 and 11 to get the weight gains. By knowing what was in the brine and what weight was lost, I could deduce what was in the meat by mass balance...

...I corrected the brine amounts for the removal of samples (which changed the amount of brine and what was in the brine) ... ...It's a small effect on the overall experiment and needlessly complicating.

I think the final mass balance was slightly off because I didn't take out exactly 2 gram samples every time and because some soluble proteins had leached into the brine. I wasn't very far off so I made it balance by adjusting the sugar."

The Brine

It should be noted that this brine was for test purposes only and that the level of Nitrite is above the levels set by the FDA.



The FDA Calculations




The Salt in the Brine and Meat

This table has been calculated on the starting weight of the brine. It is uncompensated for the weight of samples removed for testing. However it gives a general view of the movement of salt between the brine and meat.



...and the calculation for day 11 based on the final brine weight:



The Results using calculations based on the behaviour of the salt



The Meat

The figures in the last two rows of this chart were obtained by testing the meat.



Note:

I will attempt to rework the salt transfer figures to reflect the changing level of brine due to test samples. I may be gone some time!

My thanks to NCPaul for carrying out these tests.

Phil

[NCPaul]

Wheels
Thank you so much for putting this info in nice neat tables (better than mine) that everyone can understand. This forum is great for these types of collabrations.

[wheels]

I hope it's OK. I've not worked out every detail from the info you sent - I thought that it would be easier to present it simply(?) ...and then do the other bits as they arise.

Phil

[captain wassname]

Phil and NCPaul Many thanks for the time and effort should keep even me quiet for a few days.

Jim

[captain wassname]

Not to shure who to ask Phil or NCPaul
Meat at finish for nano2 and brine at finish of nano2 are .022 out
Would you think that this representts the amount of nitrite that was "used up" so as to speak and as such shouls be attributed to the meat figure?
Thats just the lake district logic

Jim

[wheels]

Jim

I'm not sure, but I think it's more to do with some of the figures being calculated from the way the salt behaved and based on the original brine, whereas in reality, the brine changed slightly because Paul had to take the samples out of it. As this was done every day or so the composition of what was taken out changed for each test. Some figures reflect this, but in view of the complex calculations (and no doubt futher tests) that would be necessary for all the figures to cross-balance, some don't.

At least I think that's the reason - I'm sure Paul will advise if it's not.

Phil

[captain wassname]

I raised it now because I think that sooner or later we are going to think anbout how much nitrite will be used up in thr curse of curing

[quietwatersfarm]

thr curse of curing

Thats about right!

[NCPaul]

Captain - Wheels is right, it's due to the removal of samples and to rounding off small numbers. I did not directly determine the nitrite; I had to assume that it moved in proportion to the salt. Nitrite analysis is much more difficult because of the technique required and because of the lower amounts. I have looked into this and I think I have found a good method for nitrite and nitrate analysis but haven't had the time to try it. I do agree that some nitrite is lost; I hope to be able to measure it at some time.