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Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:24 am
by ryankelley
The humidity in the tub is 90% when I have the lid on it... This is without a water pan in the bottom. I left the lid ajar and setup an oscillating fan about 20 feet away from it...blows some fresh are down into it.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2016 12:32 pm
by ryankelley
Inside the rubbermaid tub it's about 52 degrees and holding at 65% humidity. The lid is partially covering the container and the moisture from the sausage is making the humidity. I rewatched a video on Iberico ham making and saw they do this with the window on a factory...opening and closing it to maintain the ideal conditions inside.

The sausage doesn't smell great. I won't say it smell rancid or rotten, but it doesn't smell good like I thought it would. Almost a bit of a sour smell... I hope this doesn't mean it's gone bad.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:39 am
by NCPaul
Update? Weight loss?

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2016 2:24 am
by ryankelley
I won't be able to weigh this stuff. Some of it's done, some of it isn't. The stuff on the grate isn't done yet...still soft and doesn't feel dry. The stuff that was hanging from twine below it is definitely finished...hard all the way through and feels dry. There are beads of fat/oil on the outside of the ones that are done.

Obviously I didn't have proper airflow throughout the tub. I had the right humidity most of the time by adjusting lid on top. The more I opened it, the less humidity and vise versa

I tried some salami today and it was very good. Darker than your's, but I used the Tuscan Salami recipe from charcuterie for seasoning/spices. I didn't try the pepperoni or chirizio yet...

I'll try all three tomorrow and take some pictures to post.

This was a lot of fun. I learned a lot. I'm sure the next batch will be better now that I have a better understanding of where I need to make adjustments. I need better air movement.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2016 11:02 pm
by ryankelley

I'd say 2/3rds of the sausage is dry and out of the drying chamber. Because not all of it came off at the same time, I couldn't go by weight. Instead I used Ruhlman's rule of thumb on being solid all the way through. The stuff that's still squishy is still in the drying tub. Humidity is perfect at 60%.

Seems like the Spanish Chorizo is the third that didn't get done... I'm not sure why.

The salami is excellent. I'm not so sure about the pepperoni yet...I wish I had someone here with an experienced palate to give me feedback. There's a distinct flavor that I can't describe... It has grass feed beef blended into it.

The Slim Jim style is okay. Do you think I can step up to Hog Casings? I definitely don't have ideal conditions and lack experience. I do have cure #2.

I have a lot of venison in the freezer to work with... any suggestions? If not, I'll search for posts.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2016 1:00 am
by NCPaul
Definitely no on the idea of hog casings. The reason this works is that the casing diameter is small. With larger casings and your conditions the sausage would case harden and could spoil in the center, even with cure #2. To make larger size salami the humidity would need to be more closely controlled and would need to start higher. That being said, you gained valuable experience in the required steps with a very minimal investment plus salami treats. :D If you can smoke sausage, I would suggest venison summer sausage (I liked the recipe in the Marianskis' book). For fresh venison sausage, I would suggest vagreys' recipe.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2016 1:35 pm
by ryankelley
So I need to workout a situation with more ideal drying conditions before I move onto larger casings. Okay.

This was a lot of fun. Thanks for the concept. Hopefully others will give this a try. It definitely taught me a lot about the process.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:46 pm
by ryankelley
I took all three sausages to the farmer's market this morning. I gave some to local chefs and asked them their thoughts. They were impressed with the results. I asked why my peperone tastes a little off given it was the same pork, same casings, same fermentation, same drying.

One said this has grass fed beef in it... He pointed out that I concentrated the already strong flavor of grass fed beef. He said appreciate the flavor or switch to corn fed beef in the choice.

My goal is to make a crowd pleaser, I will use corn fed beef in the future. This violates my principles, but if I make something others won't eat, what have I accomplished?

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2016 8:31 pm
by NCPaul
I don't care for beef fed only grass either. You can vacuum pack the snack sticks and store them in the fridge and may improve in flavor for a month or two. They seem to freeze well also. I'm glad you had fun. :D

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:31 pm
by NCPaul
Luchito Snackstick

Pork shoulder and back fat 1000 g
Gran Luchito chili paste 40 g
Salt 22 g
Cure # 1 2.4 g
Dextrose 3 g
Black pepper 4 g
Bactoferm F-LC 0.75 g
Sugar 3 g
I first came across Gran Luchito chili paste in this brilliant post: ... alumi.html
I found it fascinating and it was the second example of what I would call a New World type of salami (the first example being the mole salami made by Armandino Batali ). Gran Luchito chili paste is made from smoked pasilla Oaxaca chilis and vinegar. It has an initial impression of smoke followed by acidity followed by a medium heat and richness from the chili when tasted as is. It would be easy to make a fresh Mexican chorizo with just this ingredient and there are other ideas on their website here:
The meat, 700 g trimmed pork shoulder and 200 g of fat back:
Before fermentation:
After drying:


The fermentation was done in my oven as I outlined above and the pH results were interesting in one regard, the initial pH was low due to the vinegar in the Luchito chili paste.
Initial pH = 5.48
18 hrs. pH = 5.45
42 hrs. pH = 4.7
Final pH = 4.7
The drying was done in my beer fridge and the stick dried quickly.
Weight loss
23.3 % 72 hrs.
40 % 200 hrs.
I’ve only had them with beer so far and they seem to be nearly addictive. :D The fermented salami tang is followed by a savory meat taste then a mild heat. The smoke taste is faint but pleasant. When I make this as a larger salami I would bump the chili paste up to 5 % to help preserve the flavor during the longer drying time (this is the level used by Alex and Aki in their initial blog post).

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:12 pm
by Swing Swang
>Gran Luchito chili paste
Interesting, and available in the UK too - must be worth a try - thanks for sharing - SS

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2016 11:16 pm
by moldy meat
i will have to try these recipes, they look and sound delicious!


Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:59 pm
by NCPaul
Barbecue Snack Sticks

Pork butt lean 500 g
Pork belly lean 400 g

Salt 20 g
Cure # 1 2.2 g
F-LC 0.25 g
Dextrose 3 g
BBQ seasoning 16 g

Ferment at 71 F for 44 hrs. pH = 5.2

ABRFJ Magic dust

11/14 831 g 791 g
11/ 21 559 g 32.7 % 519 g 34.4 %
11/25. 508 g. 38.9 %. 470 g. 40.6 %
11/27. 495 g. 40.4 %. 457 g. 42.2 %

These were two attempts at making a barbecue flavored salami snack stick. The recipes for the BBQ seasonings are posted here:
Sliced they look like this for ABRFJ


And this for the Magic dust


Taste verdict - meh. Maybe a slight preference for Magic dust; both were dominated by the fermented sausage taste so more seasoning and maybe a sweet note should be added. As I mentioned at the start of this thread, I was able to test a salami formulation with less than a kilo of meat and in two weeks time. I wouldn't have been thrilled waiting 6-8 weeks for an average result plus I get snack sticks.

Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 1:20 pm
by NCPaul
Barbecue Snack Sticks

Pork butt lean 890 g
Pork fat back. 110 g

Grind once through a course plate

Salt 23 g
Cure # 1 2.5 g
F-LC 0.55 g
Dextrose 3 g
Magic dust. 20 g
Molasses powder. 25 g
Tomato powder. 5 g

Stuff into sheep casings. 966 g

Cold smoke (50-60F) overnight

Fermentation overnight at room temp. and high humidity gave
pH 5.5 at 24 hrs.
pH 4.9 at 48 hrs.

192 hrs. 588 g. 39.1 %
264 hrs. (11 days). 544 g. 43.7 %

After looking at the ingredient list for Vermont Smoke and Cure barbecue flavored snack sticks, I realized the taste I was missing in my previous attempts was from the molasses powder which was listed before the salt. I also upped the barbecue seasoning to good effect. These will remind one of the first bite of a lightly sauced sparerib. The heat comes late and propels one forward to the next bite. Because of the rapid drying of snack sticks, the sugar in the molasses powder is not effected by the bacteria culture.


Re: Fermented Snack Sticks

PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 1:21 pm
by NCPaul
Mole Snack Sticks with Raisins

There are several mole salamis on the market; the one from Armandino Batali I believe to be the first. Mole sauces in Mexico can easily be 20 or more ingredients and there at least eight major variants, I brought this down to a basic profile using the chili combo of ancho, mulato, and pasilla along with chocolate powder. These were recommended by Rick Bayless to develop a depth of flavor. I added raisins to emphasize these flavors and add a sweet note. Because raisins have naturally occurring yeasts, it was important to sterilize the raisins with high proof alcohol. This step can't be skipped! In fermented snack sticks the bacteria in the culture did not have time to work on the natural sugars in the ground raisins, I'm not certain this would be the case in a traditional salami. Both natural and synthetic casings were used on these with similar drying times. The taste is fantastic.

Lean pork shoulder. 890 g
Fat back. 110 g
Raisins soaked in tequila. 100 g
(Made by soaking raisins 75 g with tequila 75 g
covered overnight then drained)

Grind meat and raisins once through a course plate.
Mix with the following spice blend until uniform.

Cocoa powder (not Dutched). 3 g
Dried mulato chili powder. 8 g
Dried ancho chili powder. 4 g
Dried pasilla chili powder. 4 g
Garlic powder. 2.2 g
Cinnamon. 1 g
Salt. 23 g
Pepper. 3 g
Cure # 1. 2.5 g
Dextrose. 3 g
Sugar. 3 g
Safepro F-LC. 0.55 g

Filled lamb casings 646 g
Filled synthetic casings 326 g

Cold smoked (50-60 F) overnight

Fermented at room temp. and high humidity gave
pH 5.5 at 24 hrs.
pH 5.0 at 48 hrs.

192 hrs. 437 g. 32.4 %
192 hrs. 212 g. 35 %

264 hrs. (11 days). 367 g. 43.2 %
264 hrs. (11 days). 188 g. 42.3 %