Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

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Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby JLPicard » Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:52 pm

I ran out of Fermento and came here to see if there were any alternatives. I use it in making my Venison Summer Sausage. I add it to the mix pack the meat mixture into a tub and put it into the fridge for 48 hours before stuffing and smoking.

I am considering switching to Bactoferm F-LC, but I am not sure about my current process and how the F-LC would work. I am reading that F-LC requires a considerably higher incubation temperature than a cooler, I think I read 85 to 110 degrees F?

I also got this from Butcher and Packer:
Each 25-gram packet of Bactoferm™ F-LC will do 220 pounds (100 kilo) of meat. You can use the whole packet in 100 pounds of meat or use half of the packet and refreeze remaining culture. Use ¼ of a packet in any production under 50 pounds of meat.
If I am processing a small batch of meat, say 10 pounds, is this saying I am supposed to use 1/4 of the packet even for that small an amount?

I also read somewhere here that a member uses Plain Yogurt as a starter culture??

Anyway, Fermento, Bactoferm F-LC, Buttermilk, or Plain Yogurt?
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Postby wheels » Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:31 pm

If I recall correctly, Fermento isn't a lactic culture in the strictest sense, it's got more in common with buttermilk or yogurt. An alternative would be acidophilus which may be available from health food shops (it is in the UK). For obvious reasons the yogurt /buttermilk should be a live culture!

If you do use it, could you post the PH drop (if you have some litmus/ph papers) please. I'm interested in seeing how predictable the PH drop is.

Phil
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Postby Big Guy » Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:05 am

When I run out of Fermento I will switch to buttermilk powder , I can get it at the local bulk food store and its cheaper than Fermento. I've used it and can't tell the difference between them.
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Postby SausageBoy » Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:57 am

It's a matter of personal preference.
I don't happen to like Fermento, buttermilk or encapsulated citric acid in my sausage.

I prefer the real deal, either a commercial starter or yogurt and the like.

Ignore the 1/4 packet B&P BS, they're just trying to sell more culture!!!

:)
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby Gray Goat » Sun Mar 11, 2012 5:02 am

JLPicard wrote:Anyway, Fermento, Bactoferm F-LC, Buttermilk, or Plain Yogurt?


I have used F-LC in Summer Sausage, snack sticks and Peperoni and like the taste. The recipe calls for .24 grams per kilo or roughly 1/3 tsp. I incubate in the oven with a lite bulb for 24 hrs with the temps staying around 90° + or -.
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Postby mutts » Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:05 pm

Just found this thread while cruising the site, and am interested in Big Guy's comment about substituting buttermilk powder for fermento and noticing no difference in the finished product.
Is the substitution a straight 1-1 ratio by volume?
Would be easier to get buttermilk powder than Fermento where I live..

Thanks for all the sharing of knowledge.

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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby nathank » Mon May 02, 2016 9:34 am

Hi Folks,

i came across this post and have the same problem in that i cant seem to get Fermento here in sydney or in australia at all.

I'm looking at one of the recipes for curing bacon in the modernist cuisine and its call for 7g's of Fermento.

Can i just use 7g's of buttermilk as a substitute?

Thanks folks,

-nat
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby NCPaul » Mon May 02, 2016 2:10 pm

Welcome to the forum. :D Can you tell us about the recipe? I'm guessing that at 7g per kilo it wouldn't make much difference. Is it a dry cure recipe?
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby nathank » Tue May 03, 2016 12:34 am

Hi NCPaul, thanks for the welcome. Must say, i've been a long time lurker :D

Attached is the full recipe, i'm tryijng to work out if i exclude it and if it will make much of a difference.

Damned people not using world wide available ingredients!! :P
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby NCPaul » Tue May 03, 2016 10:44 am

The attachment didn't come through but I have seen the recipe. Attachments have to be hosted by a third party site like photobucket to appear. I would leave out the Fermento altogether; it will act as a cure accelerator due to it's acidic nature. If you wish, you could use a tiny amount of sodium ascorbate / erythorbate (0.5 g / Kg) instead to preserve the color. If you are doing a belly, I would drop the salt down to 2 % and the sugar down to 1 %. Have you worked out a way to cold smoke? Do you realize you will no longer be buying bacon again? :D. Please post a photo of the finished bacon, we always enjoy them.
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby nathank » Tue May 03, 2016 10:11 pm

I will do, thanks for the advice! i will definitely post some pics :D

Just out of curiosity, and back to the original post Q here, could you in fact just do a straight swap for buttermilk for fermento without changing the ratio? only because i cant get it in Oz, and some of the other recip

For the everyone else who is interested, here is the recipe i mentioned:
Image
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Re: Fermento = Buttermilk = Yogurt starter???

Postby NCPaul » Wed May 04, 2016 10:34 am

For other recipes I would try it. One other recommendation would be for you to cold smoke your bacon. You can get an A Maze N pellet smoker from a couple of Australia suppliers.
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