Brine concentration

Recipes and techniques using brine.

Brine concentration

Postby captain wassname » Sun May 02, 2010 1:54 pm

In view of the fact that we now know,thanks to NCPaul, that when brine curing 50% equillibrium is reached in maybe a bit less than 1 day per kilo.Do we really need 10% brine concentration or would it be safe to adjust salt levels to taste?

Jim
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Postby Oddley » Sun May 02, 2010 2:33 pm

Hi captain wassname,

You can of course use any brine concentration you choose, but the FDA do state, that a brine concentration of >= 10% will inhibit any surface bacteria on the meat and obviously create a hostile environment for bacteria, except for certain kinds, one of which is the one that converts nitrate into nitrite.
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Postby wheels » Sun May 02, 2010 2:43 pm

Jim

We both must be thinking alike! I don't think it is for short cures/small pieces of meat, but would still do it if curing for longer with large pieces of meat.

Why? Well, although we concentrate on botulism, there are a lot of other nasty bacteria and other bugs out there that could presumably infect the meat.

Having said that, most of the others require air and so as long as the meat is fully submerged there shouldn't, to my mind, be much of a problem. However, as a 2:1 cure uses so little brine fully covering the meat may be a problem.

The obvious answer would be to calculate a brine for each piece of meat using enough liquid to fully cover the meat easily. This is quite simple, but a problem arises in that we have no model for these cures. Would they behave in the same manner as a 2:1 ratio cure?

So many questions: so few answers!

Phil

Edit: This post crossed with Oddley's
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Postby Oddley » Sun May 02, 2010 3:59 pm

Being a boots and braces man. I am always worried about the top of the brine, where water meats air. If the brine is not antibacterial, then when at some point in time the meat must be removed from the brine, a layer of bacteria will deposited on the now hopefully sterile meat.

Although NCPaul's work was fantastic, it was a small piece of meat with a large surface area, So although helpful, I don't think it is the end of the story.
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Postby wheels » Sun May 02, 2010 4:10 pm

I couldn't agree more Oddley. Would that we had more models to work with.

Out of interest, I have asked my TSO how they calculate brine cures used by farm-shops etc. (given that it's there job to check these things). It's opened a can of worms and the question's now with the FSA!

Phil

(P.S. I think that the worms were to EU specs! :lol: )
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Postby Oddley » Sun May 02, 2010 4:30 pm

That interesting wheels, please keep us updated.
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Postby NCPaul » Mon May 03, 2010 4:51 pm

I hope you have better luck with the FSA than I had with the FSIS. :D
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Postby wheels » Mon May 03, 2010 5:00 pm

I hope so! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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