Need help with corned beef brine and sodium nitrate amount..

Recipes and techniques using brine.

Need help with corned beef brine and sodium nitrate amount..

Postby Crush » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:31 pm

Hey,

I came onto this forum researching info for sausages and noticed this forum.

I then saw a posts that scared me with words about 'dying' and 'poison' when talking about corned beef brine.

Here is my situation:

I live in Canada where it is hard to find cure #1. I was told that they have Asian meat cure at the asian markets. I went and got a pack for $1.50. It is a DRY rub cure that contains sodium nitrate. (not nitrite)

The ingredients say 70% sugar, 20% salt, and then various other ingredients like 'spices' etc. One of the ingredients IS sodium nitrAte.

The dry rub pack was about 500 grams. A good cup worth or so. It tasted like 'asian beef noodle' kind of flavor.

The directions say to use a whole pack of rub on 1.5kg of meat.

I am using it on about 4kg of meat for my corned beef.

My Brine solution is 4Litres/Quarts.

So I thought, instead of using it as a dry rub, I can just put it in the brine.

The brine has been in for 4 days now and has darkened in color noticeably. The brine had brown sugar so was a brown colour, but is not more dark. The happened after 2 days I think.

Can someone comment on if things are looking OK and direct me what I should do next? I've spent a lot on this meat and was bringing this to bring to relatives for holiday.
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Postby grisell » Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:40 pm

Welcome to the forum! :D

What are the 'various other ingredients'? Any clue as to how much nitrate there is in it? Are you keeping the brine and meat refigerated?
André

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Postby NCPaul » Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:44 pm

Welcome to the forum. :D

If I were you, I'd pull the meat from the brine and cook it (provided it's been refrigrated). It will not be cured, so it may look funny. If the cure mix is designed for 1.5 Kg of meat and you use it on 4 Kg of meat as a dry rub, you would be using 37.5 % of the correct amount. Since you made it up as a 1:1 brine, you will be at half of this. The salt amount will be off as well. Basically you have marinated the meat rather than cured it. I buy cure # 1 from Butcher-Packer in Detroit. This thread is helpful:

http://forum.sausagemaking.org/viewtopic.php?t=4517

There is also a section for FAQ about curing as well. :D
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Postby captain wassname » Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:35 pm

Where are you? We have a few Canadian members and they dont seem to have a problem getting hold of cures.

Jim
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Postby Crush » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:09 pm

Hey thanks,

I'm in Mississauga near Toronto.

No they don't list how much Sodium NitrAte is in the mix. I did not dry rub it. I put it in water and boiled it and made a brine with it.

It's been in the fridge for 4 days.
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Postby wheels » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:18 pm

I'd do as NCPaul suggests.

Phil
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Postby DanMcG » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:23 pm

I agree, take NCpauls advice and cook it up. then research curing meat here.
As far as finding cure #1 in the Great White North check here;
http://www.sausagemaker.com/canada.aspx
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Postby Crush » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:20 pm

wheels wrote:I'd do as NCPaul suggests.

Phil


Ok I'll take them out and cook. They were just 3 year old cheap cuts from the freezer anyhow..

But can I ask why the recommendation was made to do this?

I'm just curious as I'm in the learning process and I see some recipes call for a lot of Cure #1, then some less.. its' confusing..
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Postby wheels » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:57 am

It's very late now here. If I don't remember to reply tomorrow please PM me to remind me and I'll try and give you a 'crash course' in brine curing.

Phil
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Postby omnivore » Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:03 pm

welcome to the forum :D

you can buy cure #1 from www.canadacompound.com
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Postby NCPaul » Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:31 pm

Consider the conditions you've given spoilage bacteria - water, oxygen, sugar (yum), meat (yum), salt (but under 10 %), and nitrate (not enough and it still has to convert to nitrite). You haven't made life difficult enough for bacteria. If you want to brine cure, you will need the right amount of nitrite and more salt.

I'm just curious as I'm in the learning process and I see some recipes call for a lot of Cure #1, then some less.. its' confusing..


Right. :D
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Postby Crush » Fri Mar 18, 2011 6:42 am

We slow cooked the meat for 12 hours over night and took it out at 200 degrees..

If it's cooked does the bacteria die? I'm all paranoid now..

We didn't eat a large portion, just picked at it while cutting it...

Is it possible that the meat is contaminated now due to the incorrect cure?
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Postby grisell » Fri Mar 18, 2011 12:49 pm

The bacteria certainly die from the heat, but the toxins they produce can be heat resistant so that doesn't help. You just stop their growth.

Considering that the meat has been refrigerated the whole time and that you were curing for just a short period of time, I'd say that the risk for infection is minimal. You should immediately refreeze the meat now after cooking if you don't eat all of it. Enjoy! :D
André

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Postby wheels » Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:29 pm

Yes, you've had the meat for no longer than many would keep a fresh joint for - so no problem. For pity's sake don't let the forum make you paranoid, that's not what we want. But, given that in cooking terms we get up to some pretty 'out there' things at times we have to be just a little bit careful. :lol:

Welcome, and enjoy the forum.

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Postby NCPaul » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:30 pm

I wasn't trying for paranoid. :oops: I am risk adverse. Please stay with the forum and we will guide you to a safe and tasty corned beef you'll be proud to serve. It's really not too hard but you can't "wing it".
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