Sour Doh!

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Sour Doh!

Postby wheels » Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:00 pm

On the previous bread thread I said I would make sourdough and try to produce a loaf without the 'over-sour' taste that both others and I had experienced in previous attempts.

Others have trod this route successfully and posted about it here.

I started by mixing 100g of supermarket white bread flour with 100g of cold water in a bowl, covering it with a plate and leaving it on the worktop in the kitchen.
After 24hrs I threw 100g of this away and mixed in another 50g of flour and the same of water.
On the third day it smelt like sick - Doh! I threw it away and started again with the same process - each day throwing away half and replenishing it with more flour and water.
A week later I mixed 100g of my starter with a further 125g each of water and flour and left this to ferment in the warm kitchen (it was a hot day) for a couple of hours.
Image
The salt, and the rest of the flour and water, to make up my recipe were added (taking into account the 175g of flour and 175g of water already in the mix).
For this experiment I just stuck to the metric equivalent of a 1lb flour/1/2 pint water recipe so made the flour up to 300g and water to 190g - I was testing the taste not the quality of loaf - that can come later.
The mix was kneaded well, risen, shaped and proved.
Image
When baked the finished loaf wouldn't have won any awards in the bread-making class, but that wasn't the aim.
Image

The 64 million dollar question; did it taste 'normal'? Yes it did - I was amazed - it wasn't just a "yep, that's OK dad" from Pauline, my mum, and the kids - they really liked it!

And my opinion? Well, it would certainly be a lot better made into a more open textured rustic (country) style loaf, but I was dead chuffed with myself for achieving what I set out to do. Have I continued feeding my remaining starter? Nah! Can't be bothered!

Phil
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Postby Batman » Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:45 pm

My understanding from reading rather than experience is that the yeast in modern bread essentially acts so quickly and efficiently that yeast development is essentially the only process in bread making. In 'sourdough' there is also a bacterial action creating lactic acid (ie sour) products as well as the yeast product. These reactions occur at different rates and temperatures particularly in the proving stage, this means that you can alter the sourness of the dough by shortening (less sour) or lengthening (more sour) the proving and adjusting proving temperatures (lower = more sour).

This balanced acid/yeast process is also a function of the natural yeast and bacteria in the local environment eg San Francisco has a specific dominant sourdough bacteria.

If you create a natural leaven, using a short proving time will discourage 'sourness'. Unfortunately the natural yeasts in a home made leaven are unlikely to be as efficient/effective in raising flour as baker's yeast which has been developed specifically for the purpose, but also overpowers any acidification which is generally promoted as improving flavour and helping digestion. (Bread Matters by Andrew Whitley has much more on this)
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Re: Sour Doh!

Postby FrenchIan » Thu Sep 04, 2008 8:58 pm

Not sure what happened first time, but anyway, here's a link to a recipe for great sourdough starter - easy to make, and strong enough to rise in the fridge, several times, before baking

The recipe is available on the BBC website here http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/womanshour/ ... e222.shtml

Good luck
Cheers

Ian
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Postby wheels » Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:57 pm

Sorry, perhaps I didn't express what I was trying to do properly.
The object of the exercise, and that's what it was - was to make a loaf using wild yeast that wasn't sour. That is, a loaf made with just flour, water and salt.
It all started following a discussion on another thread regarding additives, when I offered sourdough as an option, others said that sourdough doesn't taste too good.
After a false start, I achieved what I set out to do. I don't want a sour taste, I don't like it. The reason I did it? 'Cos I like a challenge!
I didn't continue with it 'cos it takes too much faffing about but the bread tasted good, and not sour.
I am sure that your posts will help those who actually like the sour taste and set out to achieve that.
Kind regards
Phil
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Postby saucisson » Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:09 am

MOD COMMENT:

I don't get to do these that often :)


Ian hit a glitch in the forum software, that prevented his posts getting through, now fixed, so he wasn't having a go at you Phil :)
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Postby wheels » Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:39 am

Dave

My apologies to Ian. I wasn't aware of that.
I wasn't having a go at him - I just didn't want him wasting his time trying to help me do something that I have no intention of doing in the first place - if you get what I mean. Thankfully we can all now :lol: about it.
Best regards to both.

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Postby FrenchIan » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:29 pm

wheels wrote:Dave

My apologies to Ian. I wasn't aware of that.
I wasn't having a go at him - I just didn't want him wasting his time trying to help me do something that I have no intention of doing in the first place - if you get what I mean. Thankfully we can all now :lol: about it.
Best regards to both.

Phil


Phil, no worries. I should apologise for hi-jacking your thread, but I just wanted to offer my starter toother people who might be interested in sourdough bread.

Regards
Cheers

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Postby wheels » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:56 pm

Thanks Ian

Fine by me. :D

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