Yeast

All about bread

Yeast

Postby covlocks » Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:39 am

As said before, it depends on what bread you are making - but for plain bread I think the taste difference between dried and fresh yeast is marginal.

You can buy fresh yeast easily and very cheaply from many suppliers on ebay. Buy 100grams at a time, use 20g-25g grams per loaf and freeze the rest if it's going to be longer than 7 days before you make another.

I buy in 500g at a time - vacuum pack it into 100g bags and freeze. I have frozen my yeast for up to 3 months with no problems.

The main taste is with the flour, and commercially used flour, whether it is a local bakers shop or large bakery, is the highest quality for the job it is doing - that is, producing commercially viable bread with the best profit margin.

It will rarely be the high quality flour that you would purchase from a mill for your own use. Let’s face it you don’t have to worry about profit margins, so your loaf costing you about £1 to make is always going to be far superior to a loaf you buy from a commercial outlet for £1 (which has about 15p worth of ingredients)

If your local bakery shop is just selling flour from a bin with no provenance etc - it is no better than buying that white stuff that masquerades as flour from Lidl.
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Postby ped » Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:58 am

Thank you for your responses, now does anyone know a supplier of good flour in the Tunbridge Wells area?
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Postby wallie » Fri Oct 29, 2010 3:34 pm

Never mind the flour snobs,
How about Lidl :D

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Postby Oddley » Fri Oct 29, 2010 4:34 pm

I've got to say I've used a lot of flours, even specifically those from Canada. I can't really tell the difference. On the Tesco bread flour there is no ingredients list it just says flour.

Unless it were proved that the flour was inferior. Then If there was a Lidle near me I would defiantly try the flour.


wallie wrote:Never mind the flour snobs,
... :D :D :P

On the subject of fresh yeast, I find fresh yeast gives a much better oven spring, I love fresh yeast.
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Postby wheels » Fri Oct 29, 2010 4:35 pm

Too true Wally. Whilst locally ground organic flour is better, there's no doubt that home-made bread with the Lidl flour will be a hundred times better than the stuff most shops sell. :)

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Postby Oddley » Fri Oct 29, 2010 5:06 pm

wheels wrote:Whilst locally ground organic flour is better
I'll not argue with you over it, but to be truthful, I can't tell the difference. Is there any definitive study to suggest that organic flour is better than free range flour...:D

I think personally, all this opinion about organic is rather subjective. I can't tell the difference in taste between organic eggs and free range eggs, however I can between free range eggs and battery eggs.
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Postby wallie » Fri Oct 29, 2010 5:59 pm

I'll not argue with you over it, but to be truthful, I can't tell the difference. Is there any definitive study to suggest that organic flour is better than free range flour


Oddley I think the same way, I bake bread for my daughters and a good friend, a couple of year ago I bought some organic flour to check it out (it cost twice the price)
After hearing no comment from them I said 'What do you think of the last lot of bread'
The reply was 'Your usual excellent standard but it seemed a bit heavier'
Apart from the weight they had noticed no difference from the usual strong bread flour that I use.

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Postby wheels » Fri Oct 29, 2010 6:19 pm

Oddley wrote:I've got to say I've used a lot of flours, even specifically those from Canada. I can't really tell the difference. On the Tesco bread flour there is no ingredients list it just says flour.

Unless it were proved that the flour was inferior. Then If there was a Lidle near me I would defiantly try the flour.


wallie wrote:Never mind the flour snobs,
... :D :D :P

On the subject of fresh yeast, I find fresh yeast gives a much better oven spring, I love fresh yeast.


Oddley, our posts crossed. I'll not argue with what you've said. I can't tell a difference between organic and normal flour either (it just that my local flour-mill produces mainly organic). However, I always think that bread made with my local flour is more tasty - whether that's just in my mind, I know not.

I know that you are aware of it, but for other peoples benefit, all white flour in the UK contains additives. From http://www.bakersfederation.org.uk/additives.aspx :

The Bread and Flour Regulations require that flour should contain not less than 0.24 mg. thiamin (vitamin B1), 1.60mg. nicotinic acid and 1.65mg. of iron per 100g. of flour. These amounts are found naturally in wholemeal flour. White and brown flours must be fortified to restore their nutritional value to the required level.

In addition calcium carbonate, at a level of not less than 235mg. and not more than 390mg. per 100g. of flour, is added to all flours except wholemeal and certain self-raising varieties.This ensures the high nutritional value of all bread, whether it is white, brown or wholemeal.


FWIW ASDA strong white flour is on promotion at 50p at the moment. It's not the highest protein but should be fine for tin loaves, soft rolls etc.

HTH

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Postby lemonD » Fri Oct 29, 2010 6:54 pm

Ignoring the price of Lidl's bread flour, it gives very consistent results and is very forgiving, it's a good flour for beginners to use.
Last but not least it makes great sandwiches filled with sausages made from Morrison's cheap pork shoulder and belly :)
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Postby wallie » Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:39 pm

Ignoring the price of Lidl's bread flour, it gives very consistent results and is very forgiving, it's a good flour for beginners to use.
Last but not least it makes great sandwiches filled with sausages made from Morrison's cheap pork shoulder and belly


Here Here :D

Also at present 50p a kilo.
The flour not the meat :)

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Postby Oddley » Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:01 am

There are a couple of things I don't understand.

wheels wrote:The Bread and Flour Regulations require that flour should contain not less than 0.24 mg. thiamin (vitamin B1), 1.60mg. nicotinic acid and 1.65mg. of iron per 100g. of flour. These amounts are found naturally in wholemeal flour. White and brown flours must be fortified to restore their nutritional value to the required level.

In addition calcium carbonate, at a level of not less than 235mg. and not more than 390mg. per 100g. of flour, is added to all flours except wholemeal and certain self-raising varieties.This ensures the high nutritional value of all bread, whether it is white, brown or wholemeal.


Do not the Flour Regulations apply to the smaller mills?

Britain has never been able to produce flours with a gluten content high enough for really good bread flour. So what are the small mills doing to the British flour to make it suitable for making bread?
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Postby wheels » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:12 pm

Oddley wrote:Do not the Flour Regulations apply to the smaller mills?


I assume that they have to - although I've never asked.

Oddley wrote:Britain has never been able to produce flours with a gluten content high enough for really good bread flour. So what are the small mills doing to the British flour to make it suitable for making bread?


That's correct and pre 'Chorleywood method' commercial bakers used a lot of Canadian 'hard' flour. Last time I spoke to Sally at Claybrooke mill she was using some local grain, but quite a lot of imported as well. I guess the difference is in the milling?

As you know, I'm a great one for supporting local producers and artisans which is another reason why I use it.

Out of interest has anyone compared the Lidl flour against ASDA's 50p offering, although looking at other online comment, the Lidl one would take some beating?

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Postby Oddley » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:35 pm

So, if we look at this logically, then all British flours will have additives, as per regulation. All bread flours will have large amounts of foreign flour in them, to boost their gluten content.

This leads me to believe that as long as the supermarket bread flours are aprrox as hard as the local mills, then there would be very little difference in the flours.

I have no problem with people wanting to support their local mill and perhaps pay a little more for organic flour.
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Postby wheels » Sat Oct 30, 2010 1:46 pm

Yep, "You pays your money and you takes your choice."

I'm happy to use either - but I do prefer the locally milled one.

Phil :)
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Postby lemonD » Sat Oct 30, 2010 2:13 pm

wheels wrote:
Out of interest has anyone compared the Lidl flour against ASDA's 50p offering, although looking at other online comment, the Lidl one would take some beating?

Phil

Phil,
A few years ago I started out using Asda Bread flour which had ascorbic acid and the results were similar to what I get now with Lidl's, on my last couple of trips their flour didn't have the ascorbic acid, so I never bought any.
I just looked on the Asda web site and they've gone back to adding ascorbic acid.
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