...then inject an amount equivalent to 10% of the weight of the meat - so you add the spices to get the flavour into the brine and then inject this. E.g. If the meat is 2.45kg you would inject 245gm of the brine
Now wheels says inject an amount equivalent to 10% of the weight of the meat "amount?" I'm sorry but amount is ambiguous. I guess that in view of everyone else's remarks, that means weight. So you weigh out whatever you need (245 gms in Wheel's example or 1000 gms in mine) of the brine. As I said, I thought most syringes were calibrated, so wouldn't it really be much easier to say "use 200 mls" - or whatever the volume of 245 gms turns out to be, or in making the recipe general, instead of saying inject at 10% he could either say "inject at 10%w/w of solution" (which is completely unambiguous) or else "inject at 8% (or whatever the figure works out at ) v/w of solution". Or is it that because in general digital scales are more accurate than syringes?
Ianinfrance wrote:Thanks very much Phil and Jim for your replies.
Phil,
I've been a chef for 40 years, so I promise you, I'm used to reading recipes. If you care to take an overview of the posts here and elsewhere concerning making hams/gammons you'll see that there's HUGE confusion. So clearly I'm not the only one who has found the various explanations unclear.
Forgive me but I don't think cracks about injecting a powder were worthy of you. Don't you see that on the surface, the recipe could have meant you to make up a solution and then inject 10% of CURE - ie the same weight of liquid as meat. Given the use of weights for liquids (which is VERY unusual in recipes. Just look through any random cookbook and see how many recipes measure milk or water or wine by weight), in combination with the use of the same word for both powder and solution, and it's perfectly reasonable to try to inject a kilo of solution per kilo of meat so as to make sure that 10% of cure is used. How am I to know, never having injected brine into meat, whether it's possible or not?
Coming to this business of volume. A solution of x gms of a particular cure in y mls water will certainly weigh x+y gms. However, it will always have the same volume as well, even if I can't tell you what it is. One only needs to measure the volume ONCE to know what it is, and then the recipe can be made just as general but using the more common volume measurement for a liquid. I accept that most kitchen instruments for measuring volume are far less precise than those used for measuring weight, but I would question whether it's necessary to work to such levels of precision. Does it really matter whether you dose with 600mg of saltpetre per kilo, or 660mg or 540mg? I don't know, but it's a reasonable question to ask? If it does matter, then it would be good to say so in the recipe. "Now weigh out 10% of the weight of meat of brine and inject it. You need to weigh the brine, to be sure you are dosing sufficiently accurately" for example. That would remove ALL ambiguity in one fell swoop.
A last comment. If "semantics" prevent someone from understanding a recipe, then surely they ARE the substance. I'm truly not psychic and the general use of one word "cure" for both powder and solution by several folk here really doesn't help. Jim agreed that it might have been clearer to differentiate by the use of the words "brine" and cure. Had I thought of using the word "brine" in place of solution myself, it would have been better too!
This is a fantastic forum, and there's a wealth of knowledge here, but in a sense that's been my problem. I've never made a gammon or ham and in reading recipes & methods written by experts FOR experts, I've been floundering. And sadly the beginners pages haven't been clearer.
Pump 10% of the weight of meat ie 100g brine (approx 100ml) per kilo of meat. - Saucisson
Pump the meat at 10% eg: pump 100 g of the cure into every 1 Kg of meat - Oddley
...then inject an amount equivalent to 10% of the weight of the meat... E.g. If the meat is 2.45kg you would inject 245gm of the brine - wheels
Complete Cures
These contain salt, sugar nitrate and nitrite in proportions suitable for use without any addition.
They may be used as a brine (solution) by immersion, as dry rubs, and by a combination of these with pumping (injection of the brine into the heart of the meat).
(Here would follow a list of the different products available here and to the trade, showing their composition if known and usage rate.)
(link to a thread describing the uses - brine immersion, brine and pumping, dry rub, dry and pumping - and explaining the advantages and disadvantages of each together with the practical details of their use)
Partial cures.
These contain salt, nitrate and nitrite in proportion suitable for use in combination with further salt (if used) sugar/syrup/honey and/or spices.
(similar list of product names, composition and usage rates together with essential additional quantities of salt, if appropriate)
(Similar link to thread describing their uses)
"Made up cures"
This will be the place where "recipes" for cures can be collated with suggestions for possible additions and the way in which they will be used - brine, pumping and dry rubbed.
"Pumping" This consists of injecting a solution (aka brine, qv) into a piece of meat. It is (usually?) carried out in conjunction with either immersion brining (qv) or dry rubbing to ensure that the products can start acting on the heart of the meat, reducing the risk of infection. A variety of instruments can be used (list, with hypertext links) to do this.
I guess that if it were produced all this should live in the FAQ section. That said, it didn't even occur to me to read that section.
I think I'd better shut up, slink away and read the Curing FAQ before saying another word.
(I've often wondered, what's the difference between ham (I've seen shoulder ham too), gammon and boiled bacon joints?)
it saysDue to recently discovered information, this recipe is to be used at 10% pump only This is not an immersion cure.
.Due to recently discovered information, this recipe is to be used at 10% pump followed by immersion for the usual length of time. This is not an "immersion only" cure"
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