Bhut Jolokia or better know as Ghost Pepper

[grisell]

I have now tried some pure Naga Jolokia powder at a friend's house. Sure, extremely hot, but I still think all the fuss is a bit exaggerated. Maybe a marketing trick? BTW, how many percent Jolokia does that mix on Sausagemaking.org contain?

I calculated my abovementioned sausage Semipalatinsk-21 to around 50,000 Scovilles based on the values for cayenne, habanero and harissa. Even if we count with one megaScoville for the Jolokia, that's still 50 grams of pure Jolokia per kg meat. The sausage is fully edible.

This I don't get: If you will use the terribly expensive Naga Jolokia in a sausage, why would you not want it mind-blowing hot? In that case you could use a chili with less hotness and more flavour(?)

And, like I said in the previous thread, there was a sausage stand in Stockholm last Summer that sold a sausage with 1-2 megaScoville (the sausage itself, not the chili in it!). That's more than pure Jolokia. No one of the several hundreds that ate it (or at least had a bite) got sick (I know that, since otherwise that would have been in the papers and the hot-dog man would have been prosecuted).

"...When using this seasoning it is essential that a face mask is worn along with eye protection and gloves." - hardly, IMO.

[wheels]

Quite simply I don't know, but as with all sausage development you make small batches of sausage with various levels and then test. I do 100gm mixes when developing a new recipe.

They won't do any harm? Not Much they won't!

"...When using this seasoning it is essential that a face mask is worn along with eye protection and gloves." - hardly, IMO.

If I was the owner of the shop (who also provides this forum), this would annoy me greatly.

Phil

[grisell]

I just gave my personal opinion on the Jolokia and the need for protection equipment when handling chili, and I emphasized in my post that it was my opinion. Any manufacturer is of course entitled to add warning labels of any kind he wants. I have a chili sauce here with an asserted 1,800,000 Scovilles. It has no warning label since the food regulations don't demand it. If it were dangerous, it would have been labeled.

Naturally, all foods should be consumed with moderation. A few years ago, a Swedish student died in a contest after eating three kilos of bananas. Of course, the same rule applies to chili.

Chili can be highly irritating, but the pains are almost always transient and will not lead to permanent damage. Police around the world use pepper spray (made from chili extract) for this reason: it's incapacitating but much safer than other methods. Unless someone has asthma, severe allergy, cardiac problems etc, overconsuming chili on isolated occasions will not give serious or permanent injury. People with allergy can die from one peanut. Do we have warning labels on peanut bags?

I saw no information in the article of what happened after they were taken to the hospital. Anyone seriously injured or were they sent home?

[grisell]

Quite simply I don't know, but as with all sausage development you make small batches of sausage with various levels and then test. I do 100gm mixes when developing a new recipe.
[---]
Phil

Here, on the other hand, I agree totally.

[DiggingDogFarm]

One must also take into account the quality of the pepper being used, both powder or fresh, it can vary widely.

I grow bhuts, as well as Trinidad Scorpions and a few other ultra-hot peppers.
Quality and heat can vary from plant to plant and pod to pod.



~Martin

[grisell]

One must also take into account the quality of the pepper being used, both powder or fresh, it can vary widely.

I grow bhuts, as well as Trinidad Scorpions and a few other ultra-hot peppers.
Quality and heat can vary from plant to plant and pod to pod.



~Martin

So I've noticed. The fresh habaneros that are sold here are very variable, to say the least.

The guy who invited me to try some Jolokia powder today is sort of an expert on chili, so if he says it's 100% Jolokia, I believe him, and yes, it was far hotter than habanero powder.

[gsevelle]

Understand that the heat of the ghost pepper depends very much on where it was grown. Bhat Jolokia grown in some parts of India are only about as hot as really hot habaneros, at around 365,000 SHU. Ghost peppers grown in New Mexico have tested out at over 1,000,000 SHU. That is incredibly hot. It would only require a miniscule amount to season a batch of sausage without making it mind-blowingly hot.

Can you convert miniscule into tea spoons?

[dorsets21]

my boks come from mexico from test plants with 1,000,000+ heat points

[wheels]

I just gave my personal opinion on the Jolokia and the need for protection equipment when handling chili, and I emphasized in my post that it was my opinion.

The fact that you say it's your opinion is somewhat irrelevant. Assuming that the warning was not put there as a tongue-in-cheek joke, you're inferring that he's either lying, or doesn't know what he's on about. (i.e. tantamount to calling him an idiot).

Having copped for a 'nose-full' of 'ordinary' sausage spice I know that just the pepper don't half make your eyes water, I dread to thing what it must be like with a dose of chilli in it.

Phil

[gsevelle]

beware the ghost as it has all round burn from start to finish and some ,i would start with 8g per 10# of meat and see how that go,s that will be hot not for the faint hearted
[---]

8 grams per 10 pounds? That's like 0.2%. I doubt that I would even feel that it's there.

I have experimented a little with hot sausages. My last batch contained 10% fresh habañero with seeds and pulp plus 5% extra hot dried chili pepper and harissa paste, all immersed in alcohol to extract as much capsaicin as possible. I'm aware that Jolokia chili is roughly three times hotter than habañero, but it's still around 20 times more hotness than in your suggestion.

My sausages were really hot, that's for sure, but edible by everyone who tried them, and in Sweden we are usually not very used to hot food. My wife gulfed them down and so did I. Other people thought they were really intensely hot, but got used to them after the first few bites. No one left any on their plate. They were very popular.

The recipe is here http://forum.sausagemaking.org/viewtopi ... c&start=21

You can read the whole thread if you like, gsevelle.

Oh this is getting really fun. I did not realize that I would start an international event by posting a question on this forum but I find it very interesting to be able to exchange with others around the world.

OK so here is the challange. Based on what I've read and found only one person has used this in their sausage. I'd like to suggest to those interested that we each use our hot sausage recipe, substitute or add some quantity of ghost pepper (note the quantity and type) and give them a try. I'm going to use beef as the other person who really likes hot does not eat prok. Post your recipie and review your sausage.

For those in the US you can get the powdered ghost pepper from Firehouse pantry. For those of you in the UK and other EU countries you will need to find either an Indian grocery or other on-line supplier that will ship to you.

OK so here goes. I made this today and they turned out great. Not too hot but with a real good kick.

California Hot Beef Sausage

Meat
5 lbs beef (ground through fine plate)
1 lb beef trimmings (ground through fine plate)

Spice mix
1 Tbs Garlic powder
1Tbs Onion powder
2 Tbs Smoked Paprika
1 tps Ground sage
1 tps Cayenne Pepper
1 tps Double fine ground Mustard
1 tps Ground chipotle pepper
2 tps Ground ghost pepper

Cure and Binder
2 Tbs Insta Cure 1 (Prague Powder 1)
1 cup Soy Protein concentrate
1 cup ice water

Directions
Mix spices in dry noncorrosive container and set aside.

Grind meat and fat through fine grind plate of your meat grinder, mix fat and meat thoroughly. In batches run meat through food processor to create a emulsified mixture.

In large food pan using hands mix meat, spice mix (I only used 2/3 of the mix for the 6 lbs of meat) Insta Cure, Soy Protein concentrate and ice water.

Extrude into casing of your choice.

Smoke with light smoke at a temp between 150°F - 200°F until your sausage reaches 165°F (°74C) Remove sausage and place in ice bath. I start my smoker cold and let the water and chips warm up this provides a good ramp up as my smoker reaches 200°F and does not shock cook the meat.

Sausage is completely cooked and can be eaten cold or reheated on the grill on in a skillet.

[grisell]

I just gave my personal opinion on the Jolokia and the need for protection equipment when handling chili, and I emphasized in my post that it was my opinion.

The fact that you say it's your opinion is somewhat irrelevant. Assuming that the warning was not put there as a tongue-in-cheek joke, you're inferring that he's either lying, or doesn't know what he's on about. (i.e. tantamount to calling him an idiot).
[---]
Phil

So if I express another opinion on a certain warning label, then I'm calling the author of the label an idiot? Isn't this jumping to conclusions? Where I come from, we have an open climate for discussion and can express other opinions without being called idiots or accused of calling other people idiots. If that's not the case here, then I'm sorry.

When using this seasoning it is essential that a face mask is worn along with eye protection and gloves.

I'm more concerned with the formulation of the warning than the fact that it is there. The wording is 'essential' and not 'recommended'. Then it's not just a warning or a recommendation, but a command. I don't infer that the person who wrote that is lying or an idiot. By using the word "essential", though, he infers that chili is dangerous to health. I infer that he is exaggerating, and I don't know why. In my opinion, such commands should be saved for the substances where they are really called for.

Do you have any record of a death or serious illness in connection with accidental over-intake of chili? Why are they no warning labels on packages with cayenne pepper in the stores?

You can not use an article about an eating contest as evidence that chili is dangerous. Participants in eating contests will often eat until they literally collapse on the floor, no matter what they are eating. People who are not driven by the motivation of winning a contest or a bet will be deterred by the unpleasant effects of hot chili powder and voluntarily stop ingesting or remove themselves from exposure. A few years ago, the World Championship in sauna claimed one hosptalized and one dead participant. Both simply refused to give up. Does this mean that taking a sauna is dangerous?

Three quotes from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capsaicin

The VR1 ion channel has subsequently been shown to be a member of the superfamily of TRP ion channels, and as such is now referred to as TRPV1. There are a number of different TRP ion channels that have been shown to be sensitive to different ranges of temperature and probably are responsible for our range of temperature sensation. Thus, capsaicin does not actually cause a chemical burn, or indeed any direct tissue damage at all, when chili peppers are the source of exposure.

The large amount needed to kill an adult human and the low concentration of capsaicin in chilies make the risk of accidental poisoning by chili consumption negligible.

Ingestion of spicy food or ground jalapeño peppers does not cause mucosal erosions or other abnormalities. Some mucosal microbleeding has been found after eating red and black peppers, but there was no significant difference between aspirin (used as a control) and peppers.

[grisell]

[---]
OK so here goes. I made this today and they turned out great. Not too hot but with a real good kick.

[---]

Your recipe looks delicious! I will ask my friend where he got his Jolokia powder and try to get some myself.

[Oddwookiee]

I make and sell a couple varieties of ghost pepper sausages. It's weapons-grade hot stuff, a little goes a very, very long way. I've found that you can add it to pretty much any sausage you like for heat, it has a nice clean flavor that delivers a solid heat punch without muddying out the other spices.

I use ghost pepper puree, as working with dried or powdered form clears the whole shop when it goes into the mixer or chopper. Proportion-wise, I've found that 8oz of pepper puree per 25# of meat makes for a really hot burn without being nothing but torch. I'll also use 2# fresh habaneros per 25#, coarsely chopped for texture, color and a little bit of a fruity flavor under the sharp, fast burn of the ghost pepper.

[wheels]

Grisell

If you had said the same of something I had written, I would be offended. I find your reaction every time someone doesn't agree with you tiresome, nay irksome, so don't intend to enter a debate about it.

Phil

[mitchamus]

The only way to know is to test!

I would make up your sausage meat, with all your non-hot spices added.
(up to the ready to stuff stage)

then weight out the hot spices you think you need for a weighed 100g piece of your mix.

mix that in with gloves, and fry it up to try....then adjust it from there.

If your hearing goes funny, and you get the tickle in your mouth and localised throbbing - you nailed it!

If you wake up on the floor in a puddle of melted ice cream - dial it back a little


I would make them in chipolata size... or just forgo the casings and just stuff some habaneros with it